Missing Funds

[Dacooler]

I originally posted this under the UIGEA section...

The law needs to be radically ratified to protect U.S players fast.

As someone mentioned in an earlier thread our government needs to look at this as more of a protection measure for it's citizens rather then anything else. U.S. players are still going to play but with no protection in place. The BS that happens in online poker sites will continue to happen if there is no oversight.

I, with witness, had money mysteriously disappear from my account while playing. I will not mention the site. But believe me it happened. Right before my eyes money disappeared from my account without playing any hands. Within a short time I lost over a $100 from my account without doing anything. I and another person first saw $30 disappear so we left a table waited and noted the money in the account, joined another table did not play any hands NONE!!! We left the table waited over 5 minutes and checked the balance. $18 dollars gone. Before we knew it the account was down over $100!!!!

The other strange thing that occurred happened right before this anomaly. The table we had been playing awhile 2 very strange players joined and all kinds of glitches started happening. Mysteriously my hands like AA AK would automatically get folded without a finger or piece of skin on the keyboard or mouse. It WAS NOT a disconnection or timer issue. While this was going on there were strange blinks and hesitations in the software occurring. I could go more into it but will not. I accused the two players of cheating as it was obvious at the least that they were colluding and from my and my witnesses pint of view..manipulating the software.
Like I said without going into it THEY were cheating!!!
Right at this time is when the disappearing money happened!!

My witness said we should post and talk about this. I told them "why noboby will believe it". They said but you have a witness!!

So I am posting this and I know none of you will believe it but I don't care because it really happened and it needs to be said.

Online Poker is Vulnerable to cheating and collusion and manipulation!!

Without U.S. laws in place to protect it's citizens it should be banned for U.S citizens. These frauds of these countries and the people that run these sites shouldn't be able to work at a Mcdonald's!!! They are criminals and misfits!!!

Outlaw it and put these crooks away.


I am done with the criminality of online poker and the scum that run it and the third world countries it is run from!!!

[Dacooler]

That was my rant when it happened.

So far since then I have yet to figure out what happened. I think my account may have been hacked but it is strange because I was logged in when the money was disappearing.

I have contacted the site with no response yet.

I looked up the players that I thought were up to no good. One of the players I looked up posts and posted on various poker forums (not this one) starting 2-3 years back. The player is using a scanner and repeatedly was inquiring about bots and a program that could see whole cards.
I am sure he was using a scanner which caused the problems or "glitches" on my side. I don't know if the player had anything to actually do with my disappearing funds though.
It might be two separate issues and just a coincidence they happened around the same time.

I hope I can figure out what happened.

In the meantime I wish that regulations would be put in place that protect U.S players.

I also wish that all poker sites would implement a no third party "software" policy. Such as Hold'em manager, odds calculators and the such. At the least if they are going to allow it then there should be a designation in/on the table that allows you to see that players if any are using the software other then the poker software.

To say the least I am upset and tired of our Government failing us.

I am not all out blaming the poker sites either but do we really know who and how it is run. Where from and who has access to the servers etc. Without some kind of REAL oversight there are just to many what if's.

[Dacooler]

Still nothing from the BS site on why my money is gone. I called and emailed and they said they are looking into it. B@#$ SH**

I took what I had left and played a ring game grind for a 1hr yesterday....
In that time I had pocket pairs 26 times...26 times. No fricking joke!! That is a pocket pair every 2 1/2 minutes!!!

22-AA all except KK. My second hand after sitting down I hit a set of 5's the hand ending up being set over set over set. I lost.

Other then that NOT once did I hit a set or win with any pockets. Didn't matter if I folded pre-flop raised or limped. Every hand was beat. My AA was beat by a 7 9o by some one who called to the river and got their 2nd pair, with overs the whole way they called. My QQ was beat by A6o they also chased to the river and hit 1 pair aces on the end. Every single hand lost it didn't matter.

I am just sickened by this site. Every single hand I played on it since (not just yesterday) that mysterious day had been sucked out on. Every single hand!!!

Now I know that I am not the best poker player and you always here rants about how online poker sucks. But I swear to god and everything I know that is good and right that it is statistically impossible, improbable and no frickin way that every hand I was in someone chased to the river and sucked out. Hands where they shouldn't have been in, with pre-flop betting and post flop betting etc.

EVERY FU#$ING HAND!!!

If you could have seen it you would have been blown away. I am almost throwing up now writing this. It is the sickest thing that has ever happened to me. EVER!!!

Somehow I must of pissed off the site and damn did they exact not only money by stealing it but had the balls to leave me a little to play with just to fu@#ing watch me suffer and screw with me some more.

I had pocket pairs 26 times...26 times. No fricking joke!! That is a pocket pair every 2 1/2 minutes!!!


EVERY FU#$ING HAND A LOSER NO MATER WHAT!!!(for days)

I am literally sick to my stomach!! The words FU**ING DISGUSTING is the words I can think of but it no where does it justice!!!

[kentucky_jim]

Come on man out with it end the suspense what site are we talking about???

[Dacooler]

Come on man out with it end the suspense what site are we talking about???

Right now I am waiting to try and get the proof. I looked for my hand history but it is gone. I have emailed for it but have a feeling that it will not be answered like my other inquiries.

I have a theory though why there were so many pocket pairs. These are special tables and they might be trying to entice play. Or it could of just been a strange glitch at that time. I would hope that it is all just some strange thing like that and some one hacked my account and the bad beats are just a bad bad bad bad run. Highly unlikely though as it is the strangest set of coincidences I have ever seen.

[FinalTable]

well at some point, you need to let us no what site. I mean if I play somewhere and the same thing happens. I'll have to think it could of been prevented had you told us which site.

[l_b_rex]

Im Canadian so it doesn't affect me if it is because you're american, however, I have a feeling that someone hacked the software and victimized you. The other stuff could just be extreme bad luck but could you maybe PM the members you trust so we can avoid that site? I play on Absolute poker normally but sometimes on Pokerstars, titan poker and fulltilt. Please atleast tell me it is not AP.

Install Hypercam and when you play you can record the screen. I use it from time to time. I will give you instructions if you need them. try it yourself first though. click "select window" and click the window then click "start rec". It will record that one section of the screen. However if you open a window on top of it it will not keep recording the table, it will record the same area of the new window. Goodluck my friend!

http://download.cnet.com/HyperCam/3000-13633_4-10004511.html?tag=mncol

PS. Do NOT make it public which site it is. Without proof to back up your theory you could be charged for defamation. You can however list sites you are NOT referring to.

[PokerGob]

Defamation is what I do on the poker show, Libel would be what is done in this forum by writing. In a forum such as this Libel is hard to prove because under the eyes of the law, this forum compares to conversation in a local watering hole or bar. If in fact I was a writer for the New York Times and I said, "Full Tilt Poker is cheating and stealing" without proof, I might be sued. Fortunately online poker companies in the United States are doing everything they can to stay out of the courts so actually suing a person would be hard.

On any site I've ever played on, I have rarely felt I've been cheated. I've actually felt I've been colluded against more often in live poker. Weird.

[l_b_rex]

I hear what you are saying but I don't think posting in a public forum is even close to chatting with friends in a bar. You don't even need to register to read posts. Now, you very well could be right. Im not a lwayer but I was reading an article about a year ago where a lady was ripped off by a guy for a product and posted all his emails to the world in an American forum and he tried to charge her with defamation or libel or whatever it's called and the only reason he lost was because he admitted to sending those emails. The judge gave the lady a strong warning that if he had denied it and she had no proof it would be a very bad charge and is taken very seriously in the US.

[PokerGob]

I hear what you are saying but I don't think posting in a public forum is even close to chatting with friends in a bar. You don't even need to register to read posts. Now, you very well could be right. Im not a lwayer but I was reading an article about a year ago where a lady was ripped off by a guy for a product and posted all his emails to the world in an American forum and he tried to charge her with defamation or libel or whatever it's called and the only reason he lost was because he admitted to sending those emails. The judge gave the lady a strong warning that if he had denied it and she had no proof it would be a very bad charge and is taken very seriously in the US.

I'll keep it in mind. All posts in the PokerGob forum are part of casual conversation, hence the comparison to a bar.

I'm probably the one who would be sued. That would be cool!

[Dacooler]

I hear you guys..

I am getting no where with what happened. It is the strangest thing ever. The site... I even trusted and played and cashed out with before. Then it got really funky really fast I have no clue.

Until I have proof I just can't see releasing the name. Even though I want to scream it at the top of my lungs. But the right of process in me says wait.

I have not received my hand history and it doesn't look like I will. I will see but like I said strange set of circumstances.

But again I really think that our government needs to step it up and regulate it as U.S. players will keep playing with no protection!!

[Dacooler]

Ok it gets worse. When I was playing the last of my tiny money (crazy I know but F@@@ it) and someone said something about my stats and some tournaments I played in the day before. I told them they were wrong but another player chimed in and said the same thing and spouted out some numbers and stats that can't be true. I wasn't even playing. I didn't think about it again until today I was on my last SNG today and guy said same thing about my stats for tournaments I haven't played. He said everyone uses sharkscope or HEM and see my stats which according to him are terrible and some large buy ins and a loss of hundreds of dollars just yesterday. SH@@!!! That would be nice if I could afford to play that kind of money. before I looked up my stats on bluff and they were descent and now I have buy-ins of $60 etc. and more games listed then I played. I can't find the stats that the players were talking about.

I have asked the poker site to shutdown my account ASAP. So if you see me playing out there it is not me. I have no money on any accounts right now and am not playing for awhile. But I will play the pokergob freerolls LOL. It is not Doyle's, power poker, odds, PS or FTP which I dont play on PS or FTP anyway.

I looked up and found where pearljammers account was hacked and he lost $30k but I haven't done much more research.

Anyway you all can figure it out...

[kentucky_jim]

I hear you guys..

I am getting no where with what happened. It is the strangest thing ever. The site... I even trusted and played and cashed out with before. Then it got really funky really fast I have no clue.

Until I have proof I just can't see releasing the name. Even though I want to scream it at the top of my lungs. But the right of process in me says wait.

I have not received my hand history and it doesn't look like I will. I will see but like I said strange set of circumstances.

But again I really think that our government needs to step it up and regulate it as U.S. players will keep playing with no protection!!



The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

[l_b_rex]

I'll keep it in mind. All posts in the PokerGob forum are part of casual conversation, hence the comparison to a bar.

I'm probably the one who would be sued. That would be cool!

Ironically thet judge did say the forum site is responsible to remove them. Now it may have beenin the sites terms of service satating the forum would remove that kind of chats but Im not sure. I always say, If you aint go tproof than dont go public.

[l_b_rex]

I hear you guys..

I am getting no where with what happened. It is the strangest thing ever. The site... I even trusted and played and cashed out with before. Then it got really funky really fast I have no clue.

Until I have proof I just can't see releasing the name. Even though I want to scream it at the top of my lungs. But the right of process in me says wait.

I have not received my hand history and it doesn't look like I will. I will see but like I said strange set of circumstances.

But again I really think that our government needs to step it up and regulate it as U.S. players will keep playing with no protection!!

Dacooler, why would the government care about you getting ripped off when you are breaking the law. It is against the law to play online poker in the US right?

It's like if I was a drug dealer and someone stole all my weed. Think the cops are gonna help me?


Its a risk you take. Like I said I am assuming playing is illegal.

OMG! Its absolute again I bet!. Remember a few years ago there was the inside job and they got caught? Those bastards better not steal my money! No one needs to say anymore. Dacooler knows where I play and it was left out. SOB! Ya konw. I have noticed that if you reraise preflop with pocket aces on there you seem to lose no matter what the other player has. It sure semms setup in certain situations. MFers!

[Dacooler]

Dacooler, why would the government care about you getting ripped off when you are breaking the law. It is against the law to play online poker in the US right?

It's like if I was a drug dealer and someone stole all my weed. Think the cops are gonna help me?


Its a risk you take. Like I said I am assuming playing is illegal.

OMG! Its absolute again I bet!. Remember a few years ago there was the inside job and they got caught? Those bastards better not steal my money! No one needs to say anymore. Dacooler knows where I play and it was left out. SOB! Ya konw. I have noticed that if you reraise preflop with pocket aces on there you seem to lose no matter what the other player has. It sure semms setup in certain situations. MFers!

Rex I know what you mean and that is my point. These sites sure they have a rep but most have had problems and if a player does have a problem there is no protection for them because it is illegal. ...Like an illegal gambling room above the laundry if you are cheated ripped off or whatever there is no recourse..I understand that and it sucks that it is the same case for online.

It is really a catch 22 situation. On one hand it would be nice if the U.S. would legalize it and then regulate it so that we have some sort of protection. On the other hand whenever the government gets involved things get screwed up too.

Like Jim said:

The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help.


But in this case I really think that it should be legalized and regulated. Regulated is the big thing.

In the meantime be wary. Their are other stories I have researched.....and well there are a lot and some themes really seem to be more truth then fiction. You really can't say that all the players with stories are lying or donks. Not all. Some tried to discredit players in the past in other online scandals then they were proven wrong and the truth is there was cheating or manipulation hackers etc. If it happened before (more then once) it is sure as hell possible.


In live games can you purchase someone's hand history? NO.(impossible)
Can you use software aided programs? NO
Can you use a bot? NO (but you can hire someone to play for you or just BAP buy a piece.)
Can you chat with another player or players without the table dealer or boss knowing? NO
Can you have multiple you's (accounts) at the same table or tournament? NO

Sure there is cheating at casino's but not as bad not as easy and not as much.

The list goes on add your own.

Online Poker is a diluted and twisted version of the game. Where anything goes and anything can and will happen.
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.:mad:

[PokerGob]

Dacooler, why would the government care about you getting ripped off when you are breaking the law. It is against the law to play online poker in the US right?

In most states in the USA it is not a crime to play poker online. It is unlawful for a bank to process the transactions for gaming sites. It is unclear as to which sites they are suppose to not allow. UIGEA is somewhat vague as to its rules; therefore making the regulation almost useless. It is a very poorly written Act and also puts the burden of "online poker regulation" on banks. Currently banks do not have the proper infrastructure to enforce the rules properly so again, the Act is pretty much useless.

[kentucky_jim]

In most states in the USA it is not a crime to play poker online. It is unlawful for a bank to process the transactions for gaming sites

This is true there is no law anywhere saying online poker illegal 49 of 50 states it is completely legal to play poker online all this new law does is try to stop electrictronic money transfers. What they hope to accomplish with the new law is stop credit card transfers. There is no way they can stop check by mail funding or payouts is the USPS going to open every letter that comes thru every office to see if there is a check in it going to a poker site?

All the regulation talk is misunderstood look at all the things that are regulated now in the US the car industry has regulations does that stop car makers from making a inferior product no every day seems you here of a new problem somewhere. Wall street has regulations does that stop people from being cheated by greedy bankers and stock brokers no and it goes on and on all regulation does right is collect tax money to be sent to Washington dc. My biggest fear of regulation is when and if it happens it will be the end of online poker for the little guy before it's over you will be paying rake to the room 30% or 40% tax to the federal government and then claiming any winnings at the end of the year just like a early withdrawal from a retirement plan double taxation unless you play for thousands of dollars daily you won't be able to afford to play. When and if this happens for every thousand you win 500 will be skimmed of before you ever see anything. This regulation talk reminds me of the old saying Be careful what you wish for you just might get it!


In live games can you purchase someone's hand history? NO.(impossible)
In live games you play with pretty much the same people most times sure a stranger wanders in here and there and just pray if it's you that you arn't playing with every other person pooling money to play people like you when you do wander in very hard to beat the whole table.
Can you use software aided programs? NO
Why would you need software to keep up with one table playing 20 or 25 hands a hour if you can't keep up with that you won't be sitting there to long anyway.
Can you use a bot? NO (but you can hire someone to play for you or just BAP buy a piece.)
Bots only play the way the person programas them personally what few times I felt like I was playing a bot I liked it they might work well in a limit game but the just plain suck at no limit example I was in a hand that wound up having me push them allin on the river they have something like 30.00 in the pot already and only have like a buck left and fold bot programmed to fold to a allin bet or just a moron I don't know.















Can you chat with another player or players without the table dealer or boss knowing? NO
It's amazin sometimes the synchronized pee breaks that you see happen!
Can you have multiple you's (accounts) at the same table or tournament? NO

Sure there is cheating at casino's but not as bad not as easy and not as much.

As for casino play you just have to have faith in the deal but in other games have you ever seen a real mechanic deal believe me when I say this I know guys that can make up 4 out of 8 hands come in after a cut deck the only way out of this trap is to fold and wait for the next hand from another dealer since it is pass deal most times.

[PokerGob]

OnlinePoker is a diluted and twisted version of the game. Where anything goes and anything can and will happen.

It's for sure different, but the game itself remains pure. Aces will beat Kings, etc.

[Dacooler]

It's for sure different, but the game itself remains pure. Aces will beat Kings, etc.

Are you sure about that? Remember this....

"At this point in the hand, Hellmuth held a pair of twos and his opponent had him dominated with trip kings. The river came the nine of clubs. DOUBLEBALLER bet $400 and Hellmuth called. The hand history reveals that DOUBLEBALLER showed K-Q for three kings and Hellmuth mucked. However, the UB front man raked $5,599 from the pot despite mucking his hand."

It seems that I always here how there is nothing wrong with online poker but then another scandal (cheating , software problems, so called glitches etc.) pops up on one of the sites.

What is that old saying? Something like If you catch a criminal in a criminal activity it is rare that it it their first time it is just the first time they got caught. Same goes for online poker sites BS and online poker cheaters. Also there are quite a bit that we know about and I am sure there is a lot more we do not know about. If it doesn't make you go hmmm...it should.

To add some humor to otherwise real problems...

http://www.pokergob.com/picture.php?albumid=10&pictureid=131

[PokerGob]

Are you sure about that? Remember this....

Yes I'm totally sure about that. I also remember the outcome. Trip Kings beat a pair of Deuces, the money was sent to the player. The hand history was used as evidence there was a mistake.

I also recall a hand in a casino where I was playing Seven Card Stud and a player dropped his cards into my board which was neatly placed face up in front of me to declare my straight and in a panic he picked up four cards and assembled a flush for his hand and beat my straight. The dealer allowed the hand to stand, I called the Pit Boss and he let the ruling stand and gave me and the other player a warning.

Sound fair? A flush (which he didn't have) still beats a straight. I didn't like the outcome of the situation, but I didn't accuse the Pit Boss, The Dealer and the Player of cheating me out of money. If I thought the Casino was cheating I wouldn't play there, I also wouldn't play on an online poker site that I thought was cheating.

[l_b_rex]

As long as software is used to run poker sites there will always be hackers. That will never change. And if anyone wants to say other wise than they need to get off their computer forever.

Windows for example is always releasing security updates to protect us from hackers because they have discovered a vulnerability in their software. The same will go for any software you install but the vulnerability needs to be discovered by the software company before any hackers discover it.

And ontop of that, let's say you log in to your poker site and it says there is a software update and asks if you want to instll it. If you say no because you feel impatient than you are at risk that it may be security related but have choosen to take the risk whether you realize it or not. On the good side I don't know of any sites that ask for permission, I believe all poker sites do it automatically when you log in.

My point remains though. There are security holes in all software. Hackers will find it and use it.

I see some members have 100% faith in the security of these sites but I am a computer technician and I know there is NEVER full protection.

[PokerGob]

l_b_rex,

It's like a damn. They keep plugging the little holes in order to perserve the strength of the site. Whether or not hackers can hack into an online poker site from the outside has never been proven to be possible or impossible. I don't have 100% faith in anything. However, I won't lose sleep over things I can't control. There is no secure system for stock trading, banking, Sarah Palin's email account, etc.

The best online poker sites are in the business of making money from raking players, not raping players. Let's not forget they want to protect their influx of cash and they have a lot more to lose than we do when it comes to playing. They have some of the best security experts working at online poker sites, because they have to.

[Dacooler]

Sarah Palin's email account, etc.

To funny........:)

[pjr54]

The only way I will ever feel comfortable with online poker is when they regulate it, these elected clowns in Washington can't even take care of any issue such as this. Until then we will never be protected.

[PokerGob]

The only way I will ever feel comfortable with online poker is when they regulate it, these elected clowns in Washington can't even take care of any issue such as this. Until then we will never be protected.

Bernie Madoff was regulated, Enron was Regulated, Goldman Sachs was regulated, Worldcom was regulated, Arthur Anderson was an auditor who regulated people who were supposed to be regulated.

The government isn't going to make online poker any more safe than it is. Let's keep it in perspective.

Let's pull Tipper Gore off the shelf so we can put a warning label on what sites we can play at and which ones have the seal of approval.

[FinalTable]

It is against the law to play online poker in the US right?


A BIG HELL MOTHA F$%#@ TO THE NAW IT'S NOT ILLEGAL IN THE U.S.!!!!! I'm not sure where your getting your facts, but it's perfectly legal to play online poker in the U.S.

You should come check out PokerGobs "Your Mouth Of Poker Show" Live Wednesday nights at 9p.m. Where you at during that time???? It's a great show hosted by Gob and I'm the co-host.

Sorry I just get so tired of hearing people say that it is illegal for U.S. citizens to play online poker.

[Dacooler]

A BIG HELL MOTHA F$%#@ TO THE NAW IT'S NOT ILLEGAL IN THE U.S.!!!!! I'm not sure where your getting your facts, but it's perfectly legal to play online poker in the U.S.

You should come check out PokerGobs "Your Mouth Of Poker Show" Live Wednesday nights at 9p.m. Where you at during that time???? It's a great show hosted by Gob and I'm the co-host.

Sorry I just get so tired of hearing people say that it is illegal for U.S. citizens to play online poker.

FinalTable the way I understand it as of right now... is in quite a few States it is illegal to gamble online. I even believe your state has adopted a specific law to make "online" gambling a crime. But..it is a misdemeanor in the States and I really don't think that the states want to waste time hunting down and prosecuting people. I do believe though that the IRS might start tracking down and auditing some of the bigger money making players or maybe not because if the U.S. eventually wants to make it legal and tax it then they may not want to start scaring players right now from playing as these players would transition nicely into the new "system" and be a source of revenue.

:)

I should add that while the feds have not made it illegal per say that states have their own laws. This might actually be because the politicians as usual do not want to do anything. Or that they are "softening" it up so in the future it will be easier to make it legal for "campaign donors" to take it over in the U.S.

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[Dacooler]

Bernie Madoff was regulated, Enron was Regulated, Goldman Sachs was regulated, Worldcom was regulated, Arthur Anderson was an auditor who regulated people who were supposed to be regulated.

The government isn't going to make online poker any more safe than it is. Let's keep it in perspective.

Let's pull Tipper Gore off the shelf so we can put a warning label on what sites we can play at and which ones have the seal of approval.

The flip side of this is some say that it was the systematic "relaxation" of regulations that led to our current state of affairs. Politicians were aiding their "friends" over the years in this process.

For me the bottom line is Regulation is a good thing in "most" industries but not all.

Someone mentioned the car industry..in response...if it wasn't for automobile regulations that were first started and put into affect by some of the best minds of our country hundreds of thousands of more people would be dead. That is a fact.

One argument against "regulation" in general is that it hampers creativity and growth. In some cases this is true. In some not.

When we bypass quality and safety to turn a hurried profit or when we rush we sometimes miss the small things. Safety and quality are of the utmost importance and regulation can "help" in making this the case.

Regulation is not a "cure all" as there is always a loophole a criminal a scam artist that find ways around regulation and law. Then of course just plain old fashioned mistakes.

Yes it is a scary word for some and for some it is a comforting word.

If it is a comforting word for you get involved and help make it the "appropriate regulation" for the things that matter to you.

If it is not then get involved to make it the way you want it. (kind of like regulation, hehe)

My opinion is online poker needs laws and regulations. Imagine Vegas without it? Hmmm. Better or worse?

[meph]

There are a few states where it is illegal to play, not sure which ones exactly. I know Washington State it is a felony! Wow.

Let's say a person calls up a Vegas Casino and places a bet, are they committing a crime? No, the casino is. The person calling them will not be prosecuted for breaking the law. This can be compared to online poker and further UIGEA, the bank, not the player will be accountable for the transaction. As far as the laws on the books, show me a law that specifically states that playing online poker is illegal. You won't be able to find it.

[Dacooler]

There are a few states where it is illegal to play, not sure which ones exactly. I know Washington State it is a felony! Wow.

Let's say a person calls up a Vegas Casino and places a bet, are they committing a crime? No, the casino is. The person calling them will not be prosecuted for breaking the law. This can be compared to online poker and further UIGEA, the bank, not the player will be accountable for the transaction. As far as the laws on the books, show me a law that specifically states that playing online poker is illegal. You won't be able to find it.

I hear you and it really overall does not matter as we all agree in that it is highly unlikely that anyone will get prosecuted for the act of gambling online. If they tried it would me a misdemeanor in most cases and to costly for a state to really care about.

http://www.gambling-law-us.com/State-Law-Summary/


Now this site states the law per state and in the states where it says they have specifically outlawed it it is still vague. Where it does say "to operate" but then also states to place a wager over the internet.

I like this paragraph on the site:

Express Internet Prohibition: The response to this question goes to whether a state has adopted a specific law criminalizing the offering and/or playing of gambling games offered over the Internet. The fact that a state has not passed a specific law does not make participation in or offering of gambling over the Internet legal under the laws of that state. The question is a complex one and is addressed in several of the articles included on this site.

I don't want to get into pissing contest with anyone. As for us mere "players" we are pretty safe from the long arm but not completely and not implicitly.

I will not waiver though from my opinion in that it needs to have laws and regulations in the U.S..

Should be interesting to see what happens. Did you know Hawaii is 1 of I believe only 2 states where there is NO form of legal gambling. Not even a lottery.

Can you guess the other?

[Dacooler]

Check out this article on this site. This is what I have been talking about. http://www.pokertableratings.com/blog/2010/05/ptr-security-alert-cereus-poker-network/

Also check out this title. It is NOT secure!!!

In the first link I found this to be extremely interesting...

"The implications of this vulnerability are that Cereus Poker accounts can be compromised and have their funds stolen and that an attacker could know the hole cards a Cereus Poker player is dealt in real time, then presumably exploit this knowledge to have an advantage against them at the poker tables."


Myself and another person theorized that this is what was happening months ago. That they could sort of hijack your account while you are ONLINE and see what you are doing. The oddities that we saw happening we could only come up with this conclusion. Before this we used to theorize that some player or players with computer knowledge could be sitting at a computer or computers with lots of screens up and on these screens they could have people's accounts up and know what they are doing and exploit it. Now that is has been proven that this can be done, our so called "conspiracy theory" doesn't sound crazy any longer. Or just a donk being stupid. Does it?

I just wish that I would have listened to my gut feeling (based on knowledge instinct and research) then. I in my heart knew it!!!

Also from the article:

Synopsis

"In summary, there is a critical vulnerability in the Cereus Network software which makes it possible for an attacker to hijack poker accounts and view hole cards. The only 100% protection is to stop playing on Cereus Network until they upgrade to using SSL. To our knowledge there are no cases of this vulnerability being used to exploit actual players. PokerTableRatings.com created test accounts for all proof of concept testing done during the discovery of this vulnerability. We do not have passwords to any unauthorized user accounts. The Cereus Network has been notified of this vulnerability. We will continue to report on this as it develops."

An article as of May 14 states that the new security update did not work..
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Told You I am not crazy....LOL.....:cool:

[PokerGob]

Good point. Let's wait and see what happens.

Was your computer hacked? I think you better go to a shop like Geek Squad. They would be able to find the zombie files or whatever they are called that allow people to view the activity on your computer.

[mannyfest]

I thought you said they were taking money from your account and folding your hands?

The guy in the video hacked his own computer wow, and then he claims that the cards showed before they were dealt, I didn't see it.

I totally believe that you can hack someones computer, I've had friends with viruses all that, but the video shows me that he can pull information from one computer ---his--- and transfer it to another -----which is his :) It's still pretty messed up, but I just don't see that video as the smoking gun.

Every computer server is subject to hacking, Facebook just got hacked, anywhere there is money there will be hackers..........................

It still pretty much pisses me off, thanks for the viddy and good looking out for us.

[Dacooler]

I thought you said they were taking money from your account and folding your hands?
It still pretty much pisses me off, thanks for the viddy and good looking out for us.

Money was disappearing from my account.

As far as the "folding of my hands" This has happened at different times. I noticed chat at some tables at different times and some player would start chatting about how his hand folded. Then other players would chime in and state that it has happened to them at sometime as well. For this I believe it is some glitch in the software because it happens or happened to quite a bit of folks. Who Knows??? For me though the coincidence was strange but probably unrelated. Probably.

As far as the article I suggest reading all of it and the others and the replies. The main thing I get from it is...
It points out that AP is very lacking and way behind in security measures.

Your opinion is yours and I respect it. I still see this as another blow to AP/UB they just have had one to many problems..

[l_b_rex]

Man! I friggin new it. AP again.

Don't use Geek Squad either. I don't trust them at all from my customers experiences as well as this video, in particular Bestbuy:

Computer Repair Undercover Investigation

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmNrm9vHBHs

[Dacooler]

Man! I friggin new it. AP again.

Don't use Geek Squad either. I don't trust them at all from my customers experiences as well as this video, in particular Bestbuy:

Computer Repair Undercover Investigation

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmNrm9vHBHs

Thanks Rex.

Not surprising AP is lacking again...




Also posted under AP news and information. Just wanted to update it here as well...


Here is a link to an editorial by the people who found the problem to begin with. http://www.pokertableratings.com/blo...-an-editorial/


Read the article carefully and I would have to say that for many reasons AP is total BS. They lied in the past about their security, WHY?

Anyway I wont go into it all. But AP is in my opinion a sham!!!


Here is just one interesting part:

"The next question which must be asked is what exactly is the licensing body, the Kahnawake Gaming Commission, doing to ensure the integrity of the gambling sites they house? In their own internet poker regulations document, available on their website, they state “Each Poker Room License holder …. those security controls are subject to the approval of the commission.” Does this mean that Cereus’ half-baked encoding mechanism was at some point approved by them? If so, how can they possibly have the expertise required in order to protect us?"

and I would have to agree with this line...

"There is an entire list of parties that should be suspect now, if they were not before, including the third party auditors and the licensing body which regulates the network."

and this as well....

"We assume that the networks take cheating “very seriously,” but it seems like the only cheaters that get caught are nabbed by the poker community itself. We’re told the networks are licensed and audited, but then we find that one of the top ten networks in the world has been using childish encoding schemes for years without anyone noticing."
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[PokerGob]

At request of original poster, this thread is closed.